Does 14cc band give same restriction as 10cc band?

missmonaaz · 01-22-2008, 11:13 AM

I was banded on Dec 13, 2007 and will be getting my first fill this Wednesday. Does anyone have the 14CC band, and if so, how many CC's of saline did you need to get to good restriction?

Also, when the APS (10cc) and APL (14cc) are filled to capacity, do they both offer the same amount of restriction or is it possible to have a band that is too big for you and never really get to full restriction?

I swear, I better get good restriction from this APL or I will grab a knife and a HEFTY TWIST-TIE and do it myself!

gkeyt · 01-22-2008, 08:17 PM

The size of band is chosen by the surgeon at the time of the surgery. All sizes can provide good restriction if they are placed on the correctly sized patient. Some people have more stomach tissue and fat around their stomachs than others, that is why they make the different sizes. I have the 4cc band and my surgeon told me it was kinda loose on me when he placed it, so I had to have a lot of saline in it before I experienced restriction. If they had put the 10cc band on me, I never would have had restriction--my stomach just happens to be smaller in that area than some people. Which doesn't mean I was any less fat than any other patient--that's just the difference of anatomy between different patients.

It is certainly possible to have a band that is too big, but honestly I haven't heard of that happening to anyone. I have heard of people whose bands were too SMALL and had to have it replaced before they ever left the hospital, because they were over-restricted immediately post op.

As for the amount of saline, there's no use comparing amounts, because everyone's fill level is totally dependent on their individual anatomy. I've heard it said that there are only 3 levels of fill in a LAP-BAND®: too little, too much, and just right. 10cc might not be enough for one person, and might be way too much for the next person. Also, just so you know, the amount of saline that each band can hold is a suggestion by the manufacturer. They all can actually hold more than the advertised amount and surgeons will fill a 10cc band to 11 or 12cc if that's what the patient needs.

Don't worry, you'll get restriction! But it might not be on your first or 2nd fill. I didn't have really good restriction until my 3rd fill.
Hope this helps!

missmonaaz · 01-22-2008, 10:05 PM

Thanks for the reply. I have heard others with a 14cc band complaining about its effectiveness, so I just want some concrete facts.

I appreciate the information.

gkeyt · 01-22-2008, 10:13 PM

NP, glad to help.
BTW, way to go on your weight loss! That's awesome--only a month post op! You are doing great.

faithmd · 01-22-2008, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gkeyt

Tf they had put the 10cc band on me, I never would have had restriction--my stomach just happens to be smaller in that area than some people. Which doesn't mean I was any less fat than any other patient--that's just the difference of anatomy between different patients.

The rest of gkeyt's post is spot on, the only thing I wanted to point out is that the 4cc band isn't all that different "size-wise" than the VG or the Advanced Platform small. The differences comes in the construction. The 4c band has one single ring (like a tire), the VG is a bit wider and has some baffles and the APS is wider still and has even more baffles, that's what makes the difference in how many cc's/mL's the capacity is.
Here's a couple pics to show you what I mean:

faithmd · 01-22-2008, 10:35 PM

It's the width of the band itself and the size of the baffles that make up for the increase in fluid capacity needed.

Gkeyt's post was most excellent!

Surgeon's do make decisions based on a person's anatomy when they "get in" there. My surgeon told me a story similar to one of gkeyt's points about having to change out bands: I asked how many revisions he's had to do and why. He said the only one he had to do he was second on and they placed a smaller band (9.75cm) on a man that they were wondering if it was too small. And the next morning, it was evident it was by his scan and inability to swallow his own spit that it was. They took him back to the OR and placed a larger band.

HappyCamper · 01-22-2008, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by missmonaaz

I was banded on Dec 13, 2007 and will be getting my first fill this Wednesday. Does anyone have the 14CC band, and if so, how many CC's of saline did you need to get to good restriction?

Also, when the APS (10cc) and APL (14cc) are filled to capacity, do they both offer the same amount of restriction or is it possible to have a band that is too big for you and never really get to full restriction?

I swear, I better get good restriction from this APL or I will grab a knife and a HEFTY TWIST-TIE and do it myself!

I have the 14cc band. I got restriction after my 3rd fill and had 7.1cc in my band.

gkeyt · 01-22-2008, 11:54 PM

Hmm, they sure LOOK like different sizes in person. They passed both bands around the class when I was at my pre op class. The 4cc looked quite smaller (diameter wise) than the 10cc in person. And I thought the differences in diameters (deflated) were 10cm vs 14cm??? Or something like that.

My surgeon told me that was why they have the different sizes, to accomodate different sizes in people's stomachs.

I didn't see AP bands as it had not been released yet when I had my surgery (I think it was released April 07), so I can't really speak about that one.

I guess that doesn't really make sense to me. The bands don't have to be dramatically different sizes to be significant in how they restrict, but since my band had to be almost completely filled to provide restriction, it wouldn't make sense that a band with a larger diameter would be able to provide me with restriction. The photos above don't have a reference in them (like a ruler or a dime) to show their size relative to one another. They are obviously different sizes in person.
Am I looking at this incorrectly?

faithmd · 01-23-2008, 12:24 AM

Actually, the first set of pictures is kind of telling. The band on the left is the 10cm band (the 9.75cm and the 10cm band both have a fill capacity of 4cc/mL), the band in the pic with 2cc in it is half filled. The next band (the VG) has a 10cc/mL capacity, so the pic with it at 5cc is also half filled.

Looking at the pics, it actually looks like the half-filled VG might provide greater restriction than the half filled 4cc/mL band. But you said:
I have the 4cc band and my surgeon told me it was kinda loose on me when he placed it, so I had to have a lot of saline in it before I experienced restriction. If they had put the 10cc band on me, I never would have had restriction--my stomach just happens to be smaller in that area than some people.

I just wanted to point out that a band with a capacity of a lower number of cc's/mL's doesn't necessarily mean the band is smaller, that's all.

BTW, I really liked the wording of your post, it was quite informative and I wanted to mention, you are ROCKING the weight loss, Gwen!!!!

TheGh0st · 01-23-2008, 12:25 AM

OK I am not a doctor or even in the medical field so I can't claim to be an expert at this just because I happen to have a band inside me. And Gwen I swear we are not trying to pick on you. I completely understand how it seems logical that if took nearly 10 cc's for you to fill restricted in your 10cc band that a larger band wouldn't sound like it could work for you. For the record I was one that needed 12.5cc's in my 10cc band to feel good restrictioin. I'm only responding because I don't want someone to be unnecessarily worried that there doc might accidentally put a band in that is too large. It would be worse for a doc to put one in too small and be too restricted at the beginning.

That said I too was at a support group where they passed the different bands around. The one possible difference at my group was that at my group they had rigged each band so that the tubing was attached to the end of a syringe less the needle (not sure if that is the right terminology it looked like the plunger thingy I've used before to give my son medicine when he was an infant) Point being we were able to press the plunger on the syringes ourselves to see just how tight we could make them. On each and everyone we were easily able to fill them to the point that you couldn't fit a bic pen through the opening (Maybe not even a Q-Tip) The only difference other than the baffles, seemed to be the size of the opening before it was filled, which obviously led to the ones with the larger initial opening needing more cc's put in them to obtain the same "tightness" as one another.

As you said so well some people have more fatty tissue around their stomach, and some have less. A person with a BMI of 50+ can end up having very little fatty tissue around the stomach compared to one of a starting BMI of 39+ the doctor just can't tell until he gets in there. The worst part about someone with the larger bands from my experience is that I feel that we sometimes end up needing more fills over the course of the first year do to our excess fatty tissue thinning out as we lose weight.

missmonaaz · 01-23-2008, 07:07 AM

Thank you all so very much for the information. I get my first fill under flouro today, so I will let all of you know how it goes.

P.S. Would love to hear anymore info or personal stories on the success of the 14cc band.

ParaGirl · 01-24-2008, 05:22 PM

I have the APL and am now filled to 7cc with good restriction. I am pretty much able to eat almost anything, however, i fill up fast and dont eat as much. Also, my ticker hasnt been moved in a long time because I started exercising and have decided to not weigh for at least a month, sothat I can keep working out and not get discouraged if the losses arent what I expected. So I am not sure how much I have lost, but I went from a tight size 22 jeans and a 3X top to a comfy size 16 jeans and a comfy 18 top.

socaldixiegal · 01-24-2008, 05:42 PM

I also have the 14 cc band (initially I thought it was the 10 cc band). I did not have any fill after surgery. Often the 10 & 14 cc band are left with 4 cc after surgery (this is NOT done with the smaller bands).

I didn't have any post surgery fill. My first fill was very modest - 2 cc. Then more aggressive at the second fill bringing me to about 6.5 cc total. Little restriction. Doctor said that with this band patients usually get into their "sweet spot" around 7 - 9 cc (again, can vary by person).

My third brought me to about 8cc and I have some restriction. Nothing like the "only eat 1/2 cup of food" and PB kind of restriction. I can eat just about anything and am full at about 1 1/2 - 2 cups depending on what it is. I'd like to get tweaked just a bit more. I think I can lose at this fill level, but it still takes a lot of will power to limit portions.

AlysonRR · 01-25-2008, 04:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGh0st

...I too was at a support group where they passed the different bands around. The one possible difference at my group was that at my group they had rigged each band so that the tubing was attached to the end of a syringe less the needle (not sure if that is the right terminology it looked like the plunger thingy I've used before to give my son medicine when he was an infant) Point being we were able to press the plunger on the syringes ourselves to see just how tight we could make them. On each and everyone we were easily able to fill them to the point that you couldn't fit a bic pen through the opening (Maybe not even a Q-Tip) The only difference other than the baffles, seemed to be the size of the opening before it was filled, which obviously led to the ones with the larger initial opening needing more cc's put in them to obtain the same "tightness" as one another.

Thanks for sharing - I was wondering about this!

gkeyt · 01-25-2008, 10:23 AM

Interesting thoughts. I guess the main reason for the two different sizes would be the INITIAL size difference of the bands, then. When it's initially placed, the size difference matters, but once fills start they can ultimately become equally small in diameter...although it could take longer with a larger band if your fill provider is very cautious with small fills.

That makes sense. Thanks for the clarification! We learn something every day. Thanks for the other nice comments!